Title: Is it better to start with juvenile fish or mature
Description: becoming discus owners for 1st time.
sioband - February 4, 2006 09:25 AM (GMT)
Hi there everyone, we are hoping to add discus to a tank we are cycling at the moment, has been cycling now for 2 weeks, ammonia is coming down, we have been testing for ammonia, nitrites and nitrates and ph is 6.6. will test again in next day or so.
We can get RO water and we will probably do changes with this if advised as best practice. Do discus require well oxygenated water as we have no air pump installed at the moment?
We are a little worried about the angels we want to have in the tank, have been informed that they carry parasites that can harm the discus, is there any way to treat the angels to rid them of the harmful parasites?
We have thought about getting a group of about 6 juveniles, but have read that they prefer a naked tank! Or would it be better to get a couple of adult fish? We just want to keep these beautiful fish for our own display rather than breeding, as we are still learning and don't want to make too many costly distressing mistakes.
Also, as we have a planted tank do you recommend any fertilisers either water added or sticks/pellets to be inserted near roots? Do you recommend using airstones and/or co2?
Finally, are any varieties of discus that are better, ie more hardy, for beginners?
All advice gratefully received.
Thanks, Siobhan n Andy
chinaman - February 4, 2006 10:25 AM (GMT)
If starting from juveniles 2" to 3" then I would personally keep them in a bare tank. this is because I feed them a lot and is easier to clean the tank. If your tap water is below 7.5ph then I wouldn't bother messing around with water parameter . This mean you can do a large water change if you have a problem without the need to adjust it.
My tap water is about ph 8 and gh and kh is around 16. The only thing i do to my water is lower the ph to about 7.5 by using hydrochoric acid (I add this to the storage tank not directly to the tank. However I would not recommend you to use this as it is a very strong acid!) The reason why I lower the ph to 7.5 is because they eat more than at ph8.
you can use the wormer plus to treat both angel and discus at the same time. personally I leave the med in there for about 7 days without water change to try and catch all the gill flukes cycle.
my temperture is about 28oc to 29oc
hope this help
sioband - February 4, 2006 11:14 AM (GMT)
If buying juveniles we think we would prefer to buy from a reputable breeder rather than from a shop, this way hopefully we will get healthy fish, and the adult colouring we hoped for.
Do we need to measure gh and kh along with other tests regularly, or is a one off test sufficient?
Still researching these fish and their care, don't want to get it wrong. Had great sucess with Tropical communities, and want to say the same for discus.
Andy n Siobhan
chinaman - February 4, 2006 12:02 PM (GMT)
Hi Andy n Siobhan
I have only measured my tap water's gh and kh a couple of times, and I don't think it will vary too much with the super hard london water...... the only time that i measure it, is to adjust the water for pairs......
check out the 'fish illness an treatments' subforum, in there read the Devon DISCUS QUARANTINE PROCEEDURE and DEVON DISCUS RECOMMENDATIONS FOR COMMON COMPLAINTS by granville. it will save you alot of time, money AND DISCUS! I only wish I knew these info when I first started with discus.....
BTW most of the time(90%) I feed my discus with flakes (king british), if the breeder feed their discus with flakes as well it will be eaiser for you to get them to eat when you bring them home....... And when you get a rambo emerge from the juveniles to hog all the food, you can grab a pinch of flakes and squeece them as you put it in to the water to hand feed them. This seems to solve food hogging and discus that can't co-ordinate their eye and mouth problem.
sioband - February 4, 2006 03:35 PM (GMT)
Hi chinaman, just tested, gh measured >6, kh 3, ph 6.4, nitrites 0, nitrates 10, though this is with a tetra test strip, not master test kit. Guess we have very soft water then? :D
Dickson - February 4, 2006 11:27 PM (GMT)
Yeah your water is soft.....don't mess around with it. If your serious about keeping discus, go and get the solution tests...they are acurate enough for general keeping.
sioband - February 4, 2006 11:39 PM (GMT)
Have freshwater master test kit, solution testing for ammonia, nitrites nitrates and ph. Just used a friends test strip as i saw it tested gh and kh.
We don't have any 'scale problems here, but a couple of miles down the road in N-le-W it is really hard water cos mum gets through loads of kettles due to it!
Is soft water preferable then? Is ours good then? No need for chemicals to alter things. yeah :D Or do you not like the test strips? :lol:
Dickson - February 4, 2006 11:50 PM (GMT)
Soft water is better for breeding...most commercial strains e.g all the strains except actual wild caught fish, will tolerate a higher kh & gh.
If your hardness is at those levels your ph should remain constant. Did you test the ph straight from the tap? Or was it tested 24hrs after?
sioband - February 5, 2006 12:09 AM (GMT)
Have tested ph after drawing from tap, after standing for 24 hrs and also in tank with fish, all pretty much the same, highest in one tank after introducing bogwood was 7. We mean to wait a few more weeks until we have researched more. Andy has had his eye on discus since we upgraded from 96l tank to 180l last year, now we have the 190l it seems the natural progression. Having grown from bowls with goldies in them to these two big tanks, one a perfectly settled community, and the soon to be discus tank.
Hadn't really thought about breeding these fish,Haven't got the room.Although it looks like a guy across the back garden from us has a fish house built behind my greenhouse, (either fish or some other cultivation :unsure: ) I have thought about trying to catch him going in or out but no luck so far, would be interested in what fish he has in there. It seems to become a consuming hobby, which we fully understand now, hindsight is a wonderful thing :D
Anto baby - February 6, 2006 01:02 PM (GMT)
When buying discus always try to get them from a dealers where the ph is the same as your own or extremely close.
Its actually worse to put discus from harder water into softer than the other way around.It is very easy to scold a discus through ph burn.
It can look like scaring caused by chilodennella and it might send you runnng for
Personally I would not go with the angels because they carry Spironucleus vortens too.
I have juviles in a planted tank with a sand substrate. The crap stays on the top of the sand so its easier to syphon up and its cleaner than gravel.
Don`t buy the sticks for the roots because the increase you phostrate level and you will get loads of hair algae.
Just remember that you need to do a lot more water changes with discus than community fish. I do 50% every week and 10-20 percent every second day.
Disus love clean water. 905 of all diseases is caused by the fish getting stressed because of dirty water.
Keep your water between 28-30c. Don`t have to much cover because you will never see them. Discus are naturally sy and they will hide if they have cover. Its like this. you put a can of larger in front of Willie Dickson and he will drink it.
Don`t tipee toe around your tank. Let them get used to movement.
I have 2 mad kids and my discus are well used to them.